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Post by scootersmom on Feb 1, 2010 13:32:01 GMT -5
Hi all,
I have a small side jewelry business. I mostly do wiresmithing and some work in polymer clay and metal clay. My studio is in the house, but is pretty far removed from the room where the bird spends most of his time. I plan to keep him well away and the rooms well vented when I'm using chemicals or high heat (firing metal clay, soldering, etc.) but how much should I worry about baking polymer clay (Sculpey and its grown-up friends) and about the use of low-odor glues? What about using tools to cut sterling silver, brass or copper? I'd keep Scooter off the workbench, of course, but are small airborne precious metal particles a hazard? Anyone here know?
Deborah
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 1, 2010 18:14:49 GMT -5
im not exactly sure... but i would keep the room well vented and keep him in a seperate room from your work area. i think the airborne metal particles might be a hazard.. but its better safe than sorry right ?
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 1, 2010 18:27:19 GMT -5
Right, but how safe is safe? The problem right now is that I am beginning to feel that the only thing I can do in thehouse anymore is play with the bird and eat raw food. Too much, too histrionic input from various places. How fragile are these guys? Some say I cannot do any of these things anywhere in the house and that it must be ventilated for two days to a week before the bird could return.... surely that's overkill? ? I am genuinely worried about the self-clean cycle on the oven in the kitchen -- that's another question -- but I don't want to feel tortured everytime I go into my studio! Is there a good source on hard factual information about these risks?
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 1, 2010 19:24:24 GMT -5
I would refrain from using anything that is self clean, inless you phone the manufacturer and ask if it has any teflon etc in it... Most of those do. For pots etc, dont get non stick, get stainless steel or cast iron. Those work really good i would suggest getting a air purifier, and using that in the room... or the area outside the room. to keep it from leaving your work area. Think of it like... painting Keep your bird in the farthest room possible from where your working, have it ventelated.. etc.
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 1, 2010 19:54:08 GMT -5
Also i forgot to add for the Air Purifier, make sure it doesnt have an Ionizer.. and if it does make sure it has an option to turn them on or off... you always want to keep the ionizer on OFF.
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 1, 2010 19:58:14 GMT -5
So, did you know microwave popcorn bags contain the same chemical nonstick pans do? Do most bird owners not use the microwave either? I guess I'm finding it hard to sort out the facts from the paranoia. I have stainless and cast iron and enameled cast iron, but I tend to do my hollandaise and omelets in high-quality heavy nonstick. Most of the hard information suggests that it's quite hot nonstick that poses a risk. Like 500F hot. I'll happily toss the nonstick cookie sheets and grill pan, which are likely to get overly hot and/or be used with less than full attention. But cooking is also a passion of mine, so I don't want to throw the bath water out with the baby, as it were. Wish we could buy air quality detectors that would go off at a lower level than that which bothers a bird, then we could wisk them out if we make an error of judgement.
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 1, 2010 20:00:20 GMT -5
I don't think an air purifier will do much, the studies I've seen show they don't really clean the air effectively. Good vent fans, that's a whole different deal.
BTW, my studio is almost as far as possible in our 1600' house from the bird and I could close 3 doors in between if I chose to. The kitchen isn't quite as remote, but he's pretty far from it as well.
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 1, 2010 22:56:50 GMT -5
i cant really see anything to wrong, with it, but i would also wait to see if we got any other replies on this.. as long as it is well ventilated that i dont see To much of an issue with it. For the nonstick, i dont suggest using it at all, it can kill a parrot Instantly, give me until tomorrow. I will find you a few articles and write a paragraph about the effects from a book i have
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 2, 2010 14:35:25 GMT -5
As far as I can tell from searching articles that have real solid data, it's nonstick heated to a certain temperature that outgasses and is, in fact, really dangerous. It's not too hard to get that temp, especially with a thin pan. I found a number of articles, including one from good housekeeping that really tracked the surface temperature under certain categories of use. I will get rid of most of the nonstick, but I'll probably keep my omelet and egg pans and the one I use for delicate, low-heat sauces and never use them unless 100% attended. Anything that would go on high heat or under the broiler is gone, but for eggs and some sauces, nonstick makes a huge difference and the heat levels are way below the outgas temp. Unless I can find real evidence that responsible use has actually caused a problem, in which case I guess I'll reconsider the omelet pan, but we do have a very powerful hood in the kitchen in addition to everything else. I am substantially worried about the self-clean oven and I wish I could find data on the length of time residual fumes might stay in the house... I'd like to be able to clean the oven once a year or so, and Scooter could go for a visit to the office or something, but I'd like to know how long it really takes to ventilate the house after. I think I'll get a widow vent fan for the studio and not be too worried about the studio.
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 3, 2010 15:52:46 GMT -5
I do know a recipe you can use for cleaning the oven,,, which is parrot safe and is natural. I prefer not using anything containing chemicals... in my point of view what is not safe for my parrot is not safe for me.
i have ran across many articles.. on google just type teflon and parrots, you will find alot of cases in which parrots have died.
What it does is it fills the lungs up with a liquid and they just.. die. It can happen in a matter of seconds. or less.
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 3, 2010 16:34:09 GMT -5
Yeah, I know it's bad news when it happens. It think I've now read almost every article on the internet about it. The trick is sorting out hearsay from what can be documented. One of the things that seems to be hard to pin down is that cooking temperature and the actual temperature of the pan are not as tightly correlated as one might thing - it is easy for stuff to get hotter than you realize. If I didn't care at all about using those pans, I'd get rid of them. I am getting rid of most of them, including my brand-new paella pan because that's a relatively high heat cooking activity. I will never again put PTFE nonstick under the broiler, for example. I've read the roommate horror stories and the drunken horror stories and the zoo that lost birds due to PTFE coated lightbulbs and all that. One other thing to be aware of is that those fumes will make us sick, too, if we overheat the pans, with flulike symptoms. If I am wrong and something bad happens I will feel terrible, but I'm a scientist by training and I trust data. There are one or two things that are hard to do without nonstick, mostly involvng eggs, and I don't want to give that up unless I have to, and I am not convinced that I have to. Cooking is also a major passion.
I think it is an obvious danger in the environment, and I'd never try to convince anyone it was SAFE, because it is clear that terrible things CAN happen. But the bird community seems to focus on that to the point of not giving enough air time to other dangers IMO. Even given the absolutely ubiquitous nature of nonstick coatings, which are just as likely to be on your ironing board as your cookware, the number one cause of pet bird deaths is cited as household accidents, especially drowning and crushing. A lot of care is needed all around, I think. If all nonstick was as absolute death sentence in any mode of use, budgies would have a life expectancy of about a week, I think, because many budgies go to owners who have no idea about this stuff. The statistical expectancy of 2-7 years is consiserably less than the apparent natural life span, but how many homes with budgies have no nonstick? How many people even realize that it is not just Teflon but ANY nonstick except some of the brand-new ceramic based ones that are PTFE free?
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Post by scootersmom on Feb 6, 2010 18:43:57 GMT -5
OK, so I went to the store to replace the bulk of my nonstick stuff, and while the sales guy was showing me some options, I backed into a display with boxes stacked in front of it, tripped, fell and sustained an avulsion fracture of my left ankle. Am I dedicated enough bird owner yet?
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Post by Tatianna on Feb 11, 2010 22:47:43 GMT -5
thats very good info! you certainly are dedicated
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